 |  207834 | Jan 26, 2005 1:36pm | | hey guys..i am new here, just wanted to ask a quick question, it may be stupid....well, i used to be a christian..i actually went to a crazy church and the pastor there was a pedophile, quit the church, now and have been questioning things for 4 years after leaving. i feel like i am just leaning more towards being agnostic, but why would there be a group that contains both atheist and agnostic because they are two different things right, or do you guys just get along better together than you do with christians? anyway, it has taken me a while, actually a few years to finally say that i am not a christian..which was really hard, i live in the bible belt..my family just assumes that i am still one, has anyone else ever had to deal with that, how do you deal with it? i just need some insight, maybe some direction, advice. thanks guys, i am glad to be here. |
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| | | 224326 | Jan 26, 2005 1:53pm | Heh, I'll probably be flamed for this, but when I told my family and friends I was no longer a christian, things fell apart... my friends abandoned me, saying that no true christian could leave, so I must never have actually believed, so therefore had spent my entire life lying to them... and my parents started asking if I was gay, doing drugs, etc, and eventually got me to see a psychiatrist (who made fun of them with me =)) heh, there's definitely something to be said for being quiet about it, and slowly moving towards a different group of friends, etc... though theres also a few things to be said for telling everyone the truth (seeing how much better off you are not being a part of them anymore)
As far as the athiest agnostic thing goes, athiests believe that there is no god, and that its a verifiable fact, agnostics believe that there may be a god, there may not be, that the existence of a supreme being is not provable nor disprovable, but that it doesn't matter. Although, agnostics are at times, just as confrontational to any specific god (ie, christian) as athiests are to the idea of a god... but in neither is confrontation necessary. |
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Sponsor |  Laukev7 | Jan 26, 2005 1:54pm | Welcome to the fold!
I don't live in a religious family, so I don't think I can relate with your problem. That will depend on how tolerant your family is. I've been pretty blessed on that point (pun almost unintended).
If you think they won't accept your choice, then you don't have to talk about it. What's common with agnostics and atheists is that whichever you are, you don't have to fill any special duty, nor are you restricted by anything else than your beliefs. You don't even have to maintain those beliefs by regularly attending a religious facility, since the truth, whichever it is, should be self-evident. |
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Sponsor | | Warp-Crow | Jan 26, 2005 3:08pm | I have seen the definitions of atheism and agnosticism debated over and over again on the Internet and off. "Strong atheism" "weak atheism" whatever. I consider myself an atheist, and I do not believe that anything like a deity exists. However, I do admit to the possibility of a god existing because the entire concept is made to be unfalsifiable. It's possible in the same way that it's possible the universe was created two hours ago with every indication of being tens of billions of years old, and that we were created along with it with memories of a full life. It's certainly possible, and I dare you to disprove it. However, there is no evidence for such a scenario (how could there be?), nor do I have any reason to believe it is true, and so I am forced to consider it false.
What little evidence there is regarding the concept of spirituality seems to weigh heavily against the existence of souls, afterlives, and gods/goddesses. We need only look at the workings of the brain and phenomena that affect how it functions (diseases, injuries, etc) to see that.
Now that I have that tangent out of my system, what was it... Ah yes... My family is somewhat religious, my mother much more so than my father was, but they have been surprisingly accepting of it. My mother gets rather uncomfortable when our conversation begins to lean towards the subject, and it does bother her, but she knows that it is my choice. As for my friends, they've mostly been atheist/agnostic/Buddhist all along, with a few liberal Christians and people who just don't care in the mix. I've been lucky, I suppose, especially considering my location.
In terms of advice, how accepting is your family? Are they very conservative? If it looks like things may get nasty you may just want to let them find out on their own if they ever find out at all. If you really feel like you need to tell them, on the other hand, it may be best to do so. I suppose it depends on how close you are to them both emotionally and physically. Still, it's very difficult to give advice on a matter like this from the outside. Only you can really decide when and if to tell them. |
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|  deimos | Jan 26, 2005 5:38pm | I generally tell people who ask that I'm athiest because there is no chance of me believing in the existence of -their- god and saying I'm athiest tends to shut the door on their face. I'm not interested in 'converting' them away from whatever religion they are, but I am interested in them quitting the attempt to convert me to their religion.
That said, my true beliefs are more along the lines of Militant Agnostic (I don't know and you don't either, damnit!). I try to curtail my agressive tendencies =).
As far as my family goes, they simply don't need to know. If they will think that I've been lying to them all these years anyway, I might as well continue to lie to them. Absolutely nothing good could come out of me telling them that I think their religion (catholism) is a 2000 year old pyramid scheme.
AANYWAY, the way I behave is this: athiesism is a disbelief in contemporary religious gods. Agnosticsism is belief in the possibility of something else. That makes me both athiest and agnostic. |
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Sponsor | | SamKinison12345 | Jan 27, 2005 12:33pm | I am exactly the same way as far as the militant agnostic belief, and having the athiestic defense mechanism to combat silly weak-minded fools. I however, have told my parents to their face that I think their religion sucks and that they can kiss my ass. I tell them that I am agnostic everyday, and I tell them I lean so close to being an athiest on the faith spectrum that I piss them off daily. I really don't give a fuck. I'm 25 years old. I can fuck whatever I want. I can beleive whatever I want. I can do whatever I want. As long as it doesn't put me in a jail cell.
You see my point. It's valid.
I'm a big-boy. If I have the options of an adult who be can sentenced to prison for breaking the law, or succeeding in the hard-knocks business world, struggling and busting my ass in the process, then I can be faithless in the process. |
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| | | aphiv | Jan 27, 2005 4:06pm | Non-militant agnostic here. I hate raving *insert deity* worshiping lunatics just as much as the next guy, but I don't really feel the need to get confrontational about it.
When questioned, I'll usually just tell peple the truth..."I'm a realist, provide me with indisputable evidence and I'll worship with twice the fervor you do." That usually shuts them up.
If a Christian threatens damnation, I'll usually tell them that "The existance of purgatory is evidence enough for me, if I arrive there, at that time I will accept Jesus into my heart and be saved"
All in all, I figure I'm living the life of a "good person". I don't need a proverbial supernatural parent to "Spank me when I'm bad", to know right from wrong. If you feel you do, more power to you".
Educate yourself. Read the Bible. Christians absolutely can not stand agnostics that are better versed in Christianity than they are. |
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Sponsor | | SamKinison12345 | Jan 27, 2005 6:44pm | On the last sentence, I totally agree.
It's good to be well-versed in every religion.
Especially if you're agnostic.
It makes you razor sharp and you can cut though anyone's thought process. |
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| | | aphiv | Jan 27, 2005 6:50pm | | You can't expect things like "logic" to make sense to, or be considered a valiid argument by the zealots...but you can at least piss them off a bit...and even perhaps get them thinking critically about their "fatih" (if only for a moment). |
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Sponsor | | SamKinison12345 | Jan 27, 2005 6:52pm | You can fuck up the zealots if you know more about their shit than they do. I do it all day long to all denominations.
A particular viewpoint that might be interesting to you. DIESM...look it up on googlesearch. |
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